SRAM Leads the way to Better Braking with new Guide Trail Brakes

No where does it say avid on this product…. interesting

you lost me at dot fluid

Hrmmm, I was hoping they would swap to mineral oil – DOT is fine, but the drawbacks are pretty crappy compared to issues with mineral oil. Seems like they’re sticking with DOT just to be different from Shimano.

“…combined with a piggyback reservoir instead of the Taperbore…”

Oh look, re-badged Juicy’s.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, looks like XTR, wonder why. Oh , because they work!!!!!!!

Hope FSA got a tip for the rip off that SRAVID did by poaching their master cylinder design. http://www.fullspeedahead.com/news/449/FSA-Hydraulic-XC-Race-and-Trail-Disc-Brakes-
But also interesting how they are killing off the Avid name. And how they’re poaching TPC + from Manitou.

Hopefully the release of these brakes wont mean doubling the amount of avid brakes i have to call in for warranty…

DOT fluid is a superior hydraulic fluid relative to mineral oil, no question. From a materials handling standpoint, not so much. I personally found that any of the litany of problems with old Elixirs could be solved with careful caliper rebuilds using new seals and generous DOT grease, and lever issues with a complete replacement of the piston. Simple fixes that point to a lack of QC and poor tolerances from mass production. I feel like instead of making a simpler, heavier, bulkier lever, they could have simply fixed their known issues. Now we have a more rudimentary lever and a more complex caliper that will be overkill for most riders.

lol. This is hilarious.

‘Simple problems could be fixed with careful caliper overhauls with lots of DOT grease and fresh seals’.

I can by the cheapest Shimano BR-M440 for the cost of a caliper rebuild, and it will last me a season of heavy use. It is almost hard to even replace the pads in that brake as they’re $25 and the brake is $70.

I can also bleed the brake in sub 10, often sub 5 minutes. Branding or not, this may not say Avid, but lets be real with ourselves. It is an Avid brake.

DOT has pretty much no advantage in a bicycle brake application over Mineral. It is hydrophillic, and it traps air, and eats paint, and awful on skin.

Why they insist on sticking to old, dying technology is beyond me. Do something innovative, make the brake reliable, easier than a Shimano to bleed, and hell try and shave a gram.

I’m going to unleash my inner weight weenie. XT/SLX’s are way lighter. I don’t feel I need four pistons for XC riding, so i’m hoping for a 2-piston variant that sheds some weight, or is at least WAY cheaper than a set of SLX’s, otherwise I still don’t see a reason to leave Shimano. But i’m not going to completely discount them, and would definitely consider them if I rode AM/”Enduro”.

I can understand the name change to SRAM.
After the great success of their road discs….SRAM is the first name I think of when it comes to disc brakes.
And recalls.
And re-recalls.

because one full brake recall wasn’t enough

@Ck – Those weights include rotors. XT = 262g + 115g (RT86) = 377g

XT MSRP = $139.99, so comparable to the Guide RS @ $149 and 380g

As for 2 vs 4 pistons, SRAM is claiming only a 4 gram penalty for the 4 piston caliper compared to their 2 piston XC calipers.

@Mirwin- There are big differences between these and Juicies: first, they are DOT instead of mineral oil-based; second, the Juicies have a flat rate- you pull 1cm, the pads move 1mm, you pull 2cm, the pads move 2mm (for example), whereas with these, the rate changes- you pull at the beginning, and the pads move a lot and get to the disc quickly, but afterwards the pads move less, but with more power. The Elixirs did the same thing, but they accomplished it through the volume of the master cylinder (“Taperbore”- the MC is bored out not with a constant diameter, but with a taper). Shimano brakes marked Servo-Wave do the same thing, I am not sure how.
The Guides do it with some kind of rocker (cam), according to the text. It looks like SRAM-Avid away from their theoretically sound but factually flawed Taperbore system and towards something which does the same thing with simpler tech.
If you can combine these with the newest Shimano Ice-Tech rotors, then you have the ultimate heat resistant disc brake.

Torx hardware on a brake lever is silly. Who carries Torx drivers with them on a ride?

does anyone know if they’re planning on releasing a halfbike version of these brakes?

Tim, rotor bolts are also T25 and most multitools include at least that size.

So when these leak brake fluid and it eats up your pretty new paint don’t say I didn’t tell you. Had so much “scram” FAIL, no way , no day.

do they offer any explanation of how their TPC is different from every other brake’s timing port system? Or is this just a buzz word for a system they got miserably wrong for so many years (taper bore) and now they’re just doing it like everyone else?

SRAM is lucky they have good drivetrains and forks to support their brake business. Because if SRAM brakes were their own company, they would have been bankrupt several times over. The only saps that use them are those stuck with them on an OEM bike and those that are convinced that all things SRAM are good.

I will not run SRAM hydraulic brakes no matter what the brand. They would have to be significantly better than Shimano for 5 years for me to even consider it. Even then, they would probably just screw it up on the next generation of product.

In fact, I am getting so sick of SRAM’s ineptitude here I am seriously giving up on their drivetrains too, which I currently run on my bikes. Shimano provides more value and I know they won’t ship shoddy product.

I absolutely love my 2012 Code brakes when they’re working they can’t be beat. I hate that I have to bleed them every couple of months but if you want raw braking power you need 4 piston. I love Shimano’s reliability and easy of maintenance but they just don’t have the raw braking power of SRAMs. No way no how.

I welcome a design change. I couldn’t get myself to buy the new Trail brakes since they had the same Taper bore crap.

Just removed some old Elixirs and replaced them with Hope E4s. The 4-piston E4s are actually lighter than the 2-piston Avids that they replaced, plus I get bite point and reach adjust. These new SRAMs seem to have a lot of the Hope’s features, but in terms of reliability and durability I’ll stick with what I know works (I’ve been using Hope X2s for a long time).

AZBikeFreak: You did not try Zee and Saint. If you need more brake power than that – you are doing it wrong (or use small rotors).

@Padrote- about bolts- yeah, rotor bolts are T25, but I don’t touch rotor bolts- lever bolts do need adjustment from time to time. Sucks everything is going Torx, just another meaningless switch.
@J-Train- So what if it’s a rip-off of Servo-Wave? I care about whether something works well, not who made it first.
@Groghunter- thanks, you saved me from buying stuff that could have been dangerous for me. Didn’t know Juicies were DOT. I find hydros interesting, but have always run BB7s.

Torx is a superior bolt head design. Its lighter, can be made shallower, and is less likely to strip than an Allen.

The only people that complain about Torx are those who dont own the tools.